parry, parry, riposte.

[grunyo]

part of not getting hit in weapon to weapon combat is the ability to parry an attack.  Now on a successful parry, there's a chance you've caused the opponent to be caught off guard, or you've even disarmed them of their weaponry. At that point, there's a riposte.

There could be weapons and offhands that would boost parry, and maybe gloves, but it should be limited to only these things.

Riposte would be a basic combat quest that anyone should be able to do

[ZLemur]

I'll give you parry as a cross class skill, but riposte i think should be limited a little more by class. When's the last time you saw a priest parry and riposte?

Unless the skill/combat system is changed in such a drastic way to be completely open ended. which would be cool.

Imagine this:

[insert gargantuan skill set here]
[insert number of CP here]
[buy a skill for xx CP here]
[train higher levels of the skill with CP here]
[or have the skill increase when used while fighting a mob of equal or higher level]

Could make certain skills conflict and raise the cost to keep it more balanced. Like heavy combat skills increase heavy spell casting skills by a certain amount or %.

I don't see this happening, though. I think vitoc/cow already have a system in mind.

sorry to hijack the thread.

[grunyo]

yeah, it could be limited. But if by limiting it, you mean give all the power to witchunters, warriors, paladins, clerics, rangers, warlocks and ninjas, I would have to say, "Nevermind, then."

[The Crazy Animal]

Maybe I'm thinking of this differently but not all weapons are meant to be used like this. I think if this was put in the game it should be on the condition that its weapon dependant. Last thing I want to see is someone parry with a longbow against a strike from a greatsword.

Don't get me wrong though I like the idea of having expanded combat moves.

[grunyo]

oh, yeah. most definitely.

I dunno if you ever played Neverwinter Nights, but they have "parry mode" as a combat mode. There's gloves, and swords specifically that'll add to parry, and you don't attack as normal. It's a defensive stance, and on a successful parry the character gets a riposte attempt.

It's nice because if you have crap armours, but high dex you can survive against someone.

[The Crazy Animal]

I can?t say I?ve ever played Neverwinter Nights.

The way I think of this is that it should be handled like dodge something a character with the skill is able to automatically if a weapon of appropriate type is wielded by one or more of the players or NPC that are engaged in combat. Appropriate weapons would be of the saber, rapier, foil, cutlass, light broadsword types.

Now there is more to riposte and parry though if you ever watched fencing. MMUD combat is very similar to fencing since it uses basic right of way to decide who gets to attack. The player who has right of way is the player that is launching the attacks at that moment.

Here is how I could see it working: As we know each players swing count is determined by the amount of energy they have, and each swing reduces that amount of energy. After a players energy reaches a point were they can?t make a swing right of way is given to the next player in the combat sequence. What parry and riposte would basically do is give players or npcs the ability to snatch right of way. I?ve lightened this system a little from how fencing uses it but it should provide a good basis for using it.

Terms:
Parry is a special defensive block.
Riposte is an offensive action made after a successful parry {gains right of way}
Counter-riposte is an offensive movement made in response to someone?s attempt at a riposte {keeps right of way}
Counter-parry a parry made by an opponent in response to a parry {removes chance of riposte}
Mal-parry ? a failed parry

Assuming player and NPC both have the skills this is how combat would look:
(The Player or NPC that attacks first has right of way)

<Player1 engages combat>
{Right of way goes to player1}
Player1 swings and NPC takes damage!
Player1 swings but misses!
Player1 swings, but NPC parries, and player1 counter-parries!
Player1 swings and NPC takes damage!
{Right of way goes to NPC}
NPC swings and player1 takes damage!
NPC swings, but player1 parries!
NPC swings, but player1 dodges!
NPC swings but misses!
{Right of way goes to player1}
Player1 swings, but NPC Mal-parries and NPC takes damage!
Player1 swings but misses!
Player1 swings, but NPC dodges!
Player1 swings and NPC takes damage!
{Right of way goes to NPC}
NPC swings, but player1 dodges!
NPC swings, but player1 parries!
Player1 ripostes and NPC takes damage!
{Right of way goes to player1}
Player1 swings, but NPC parries!
NPC attempts a ripostes, but player1 counter-ripostes and NPC takes damage!
{Right of way stays with player1}
Player1 swings and NPC takes damage!
Player1 swings, but NPC dodges!
Player1 swings and NPC takes damage!

Now the thing is this would make the game favor one-handed sharps so something might need to be put in for the other weapon types to balance things out. Block and or Counter-strike in my opinion would probably be good choices to do that with. Maybe feather weight weapons could get something like double strike.

[grunyo]

a way to balance it out, would be to give a stun attack with blunts.

rather than just have it cast as a combat spell, a combat skill like smash.

too early.. need coffee..

[The Crazy Animal]

I don?t know about stun I think that should be kept as one of those chance spells for special weapons. I figure this needs to be something that balances the damage plus additional swings while not removing altogether the chance of parry and the advantages that it would give. Stun would do some of that but since it removes a full round it would remove the possibility of doing a parry. So it would really be something that might work to well if you know what I mean.

The last thing I think people would want to see is:
<Player1 engages combat>
{Right of way goes to player1}
Player1 hits you, you are stunned and take damage!
Player1 hits you, you take damage!
Player1 swings, but misses
<You are to stunned to move>
Player1 hits you, you take damage!
Player1 hits you, you are stunned and take damage!
Player1 swings, but misses
<You are to stunned to move>
And on and on and on?.
stun can become overpowered really quick.

Now it?s also not just the blunt weapons that need the balance to; there are a fair amount of 1-handed sharps like axes that shouldn?t be able to parry and would need something to that?s kind of why I was suggesting: Block, counter-strike.

Block works well because it negates damage and similar to a parry
Counter-strike is like a parry/riposte in one move but wouldn?t gain right of way perhaps this could work against both riposte and parry. However when used against a parry it stops the chance of a riposte.

Now there are some weapons that just aren?t made to do moves like this too, like whips, and ranged weapons. Ranged weapons are easy just have them give a larger bonus to dodge. Small fast weapons though that can?t block would still need something to balance them out. I thought maybe some type of double strike would help but I?m not sure if that alone would be enough.

TCA

[grunyo]

how about every blunt has the power to stun, only it's not always going to be easy to do.

Make it a chance % spell, like the way it is with a few of the blunts now. But make the base for every blunt weapon, like, 1-2%.

[The Crazy Animal]

Grin you must really like stun. I think the heavy bone club has like a 5% chance of stun and its not that powerful. I would really need to see how the parry stuff worked out first to really know what needs to be done to balance it. There are more weapons though than just blunt that would probably need some combat additions if it went in.

[grunyo]

axes rip
swords parry
maces stun.

[The Crazy Animal]

I think your stuck on this single ability thing as a fix... Rip and Stun are things special weapons should get not every weapon ranging from a stick to a great-axe.

If you improve combat for swords there needs to be improvements that are relatively even with the ones made for swords. No single ability is going to do that.

If swords get a block such as parry, the blunts and axes need a block too.
If swords get a out of sequence attack such as riposte, the blunts and axes need one too.

Keeping an across the board balance is key here.

TCA